+1
On Mon, Mar 15, 2021 at 4:36 PM Bernd Oberknapp bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de wrote:
I assume the recommendation would be to use pairwise-id (not subject-id) for personalization, and eduPersonTargetedID as a fallback for IdPs or SPs that don't support pairwise-id yet.
If a SP supports eduPersonTargetedID it has to be prepared to transition to pairwise-id and preserve the personal accounts during that transition.
Best regards, Bernd
On 15.03.21 16:26, Heather Flanagan wrote:
I know it does not help matters, but I need to point out that eduPersonTargetedID is actually deprecated due to security concerns. Instead, organizations are encouraged to use the SAML attribute, subject-id
( https://docs.oasis-open.org/security/saml-subject-id-attr/v1.0/cs01/saml-sub... ).
Heather Flanagan — Translator of Geek to Human https://sphericalcowconsulting.com On Mar 15, 2021, 8:18 AM -0700, Jos Westerbeke jos.westerbeke@eur.nl, wrote:
Hi Jiri, Bernd et al,
thank you for this discussion. This is very meaningful for downplaying the FIM4L recommendations 4.A and 4.B to a more simple level.
We now have two recommendations which you have to (unfortunately)
choose:
4.A. Transitory Access - eduPersonTargetedID as optional would be fine for this. 4.B. Personalized Access - eduPersonTargetedID required.
- And for 4.B the recommendation is to let it be for the SP side to
offer a profile, voluntarily to configure by users. So that in any way IdP's do not have to release PII. (https://www.fim4l.org/?page_id=257)
What would we actually recommend for librarians? Wouldn't it be nice to have just one option? I think it is too difficult for librarians to choose here.
Reading the discussion, we can say that we cannot recommend going just for 4.B. And if librarians consider switching form IP to SAML they are very suspicious about privacy.
Can we recommend for both IdP's and SP's to go for 4.A?
What about recommending 4.A and have the option for 4.B when there is an agreement between IdP and SP about creating profiles, anchored in a contract?
Should we recommend a contract clausula alongside 4.B?
As far as I understand, I'm aware of what Meshna says: If you opt for 4.A then it is simply not possible to have a profile, which is very annoying if not impossible for our patrons.
Best, Jos
*From:* FIM4L fim4l-bounces@lists.daasi.de on behalf of Jiri Pavlik jiri.pavlik@techlib.cz *Sent:* 15 March 2021 14:58 *To:* Koren, Meshna (ELS-AMS) M.Koren@elsevier.com *Cc:* fim4l@lists.daasi.de fim4l@lists.daasi.de *Subject:* Re: [Fim4l] LexisNexis Advance Hi Meshna,
thanks a lot for the comments.
At Elsevier SP metadata [1] I can see: eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (optional) in DFN-AAI, IDEM or Australian Access Federation.
At the SP metadata in eduGAIN / UK Federation there are no requested attributes. At the SP metadata in eduID.at, SWITCHaai, InCommon, RENATER I can see: eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (required)
It illustrates different approaches around the world how to express optional ePTID release in SP metadata and a challenge for one appropriate SP metadata in eduGAIN serving globally. To me eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (optional) seems as the most appropriate.
Cheers Jiri
https://met.refeds.org/met/entity/https%253A%252F%252Fsdauth.sciencedirect.c...
< https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmet.refeds...
On Mon, Mar 15, 2021 at 12:01 PM Koren, Meshna (ELS-AMS) <M.Koren@elsevier.com mailto:M.Koren@elsevier.com> wrote:
Please allow me to add something to this discussion. ____ __ __ "The university students and staff are free to use personalisation at Lexis Nexis, Elsevier, EBSCO, ProQuest services if they want to so eduPersonScopedAffiliation (required) eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (optional)..." ____ The students and staff can only use personalization when the IdP releases ePTID (or pairwiseID), otherwise they can't. I am not sure that this is clear from the metadata nor that the labels we use to describe the required attributes are very clear on what 'optional' means.____ __ __ For example, when a student accesses ScienceDirect they can read subscribed articles whether or not ePTID has been released for them, but if they want to 'create account' because they would like to save searches, alerts or their search history, they can only do that if the IdP has released a persistent identifier for them. Otherwise they can't, because there's nothing in their SAML assertions that allows us to recognize the returning individual. So we are working towards requiring a persistent ID. The personalization remains optional for the user.____ __ __ That may not be the same for other SPs, but it is valid for Elsevier. ____ __ __ Kind regards,____ Meshna____ __ __ __ __ *__ __* *Meshna Koren* *____* /Product Manager II____/ */Product Management - Identity and Access/* */-/* */Research Products/**/____/* */__ __/* */Elsevier BV/*/____/ /Radarweg 29, Amsterdam 1043 NX, The Netherlands____/ /m.koren@elsevier.com <mailto:m.koren@elsevier.com>____/ /__ __/ /Federated Access - SAML, Shibboleth, Corporate SSO, OpenAthens, Institutional Login____/ /__ __/ /Elsevier Access Support Center:https://service.elsevier.com/app/answers/list/c/10543/supporthub/elsevieracc...
< https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fservice.el...
____/
/for your questions about which access methods does Elsevier support, how to set them up, how do they work for users...____/ /__ __/ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ *From:* FIM4L <fim4l-bounces@lists.daasi.de <mailto:fim4l-bounces@lists.daasi.de>> *On Behalf Of* Jiri Pavlik *Sent:* Sunday, March 14, 2021 15:28 *To:* Bernd Oberknapp <bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de <mailto:bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de>> *Cc:* fim4l@lists.daasi.de <mailto:fim4l@lists.daasi.de> *Subject:* Re: [Fim4l] LexisNexis Advance____ __ __ **** External email: use caution ****____ ____ Hi Bernd, I see, eduPersonScopedAffiliation (required) eduPersonEntitlement (required) is working for Freiburg University and eduPersonScopedAffiliation (required) eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (required) is not. The university students and staff are free to use personalisation at Lexis Nexis, Elsevier, EBSCO, ProQuest services if they want to so eduPersonScopedAffiliation (required) eduPersonEntitlement (required) eduPersonTargetedID (optional) is working for the University as well. Is it correct? All the best Jiri____ __ __ ____ On Sat, Mar 13, 2021 at 2:40 PM Bernd Oberknapp <bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de <mailto:bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de>> wrote:____ Hi Jiri, On 13.03.21 09:15, Jiri Pavlik wrote: > When checking ProQuest SP for ProQuest Central in DFN-AAI metadata [1] > I can see both eduPersonEntitlement and eduPersonTargetedID as required > attributes. I assume you mean the SP https://shibboleth-sp.prod.proquest.com/shibboleth< https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fshibboleth...
That's obviously wrong, both eduPersonScopedAffiliation and eduPersonEntitlement are supported for authorization, but as far as I can tell you don't have to use them, and eduPersonTargetedID isn't required. > Is it safe to assume that if there is personalisation capability at a > library service then all German universities, libraries are fine with > releasing eduPersonTargetedID for recognising returning users and > eduPersonEntitlement, eduPersonScopedAffiliation for authorisation? No. I can't speak for other IdPs, but in my opinion that approach would be wrong, users by default should be able to use services anonymously, without being recognized as a returning user. Based on what I can see in the admin tools, only a very small percentage of our users actually uses the personalization features, so releasing eduPersonTargetedID by default just for personalization isn't an option. If publishers would force us to send an eduPersonTargetedID just for personalization I would consider dropping Shibboleth for those publishers and using our EZproxy instead. Best regards, Bernd -- Bernd Oberknapp Gesamtleitung ReDI Albert-Ludwigs-Universität Freiburg Universitätsbibliothek Platz der Universität 2 | Postfach 1629 D-79098 Freiburg | D-79016 Freiburg Telefon: +49 761 203-3852 Telefax: +49 761 203-3987 E-Mail: bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de <mailto:bo@ub.uni-freiburg.de> Internet: www.ub.uni-freiburg.de< https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ub.uni-...
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-- Bernd Oberknapp Gesamtleitung ReDI
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